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 Repetitive Prayer
 
 11/14/2006 7:44:07 AM
User is offlinekcstrobel
50 posts


Repetitive Prayer
 (United Kingdom)

In the disciplines section, someone left this comment: How do you reconcile repetitive prayer in light of Jesus saying we should not be "like pagans, who think they will be heard for their many words..."

This is a great question. We must always be aware in all types of prayer and meditation what the dangers and pitfalls may be for us - but lets not narrow it here, everytime we pray we are open to these dangers.

In terms of the Jesus Prayer, I think, if done appropraitely, it fails to fall into these traps. The passage being talked about from the sermon on the mount makes it clear what the issue is: they think they will be heard for their many words. The Jesus Prayer has nothing to do with this. The Jesus Prayer follows a tradition of people who now live in circumstances beyond physical persecution, and for the same reason people started wearing crosses - because we need to be reminded of the reality we are in - we say the Jesus Prayer, because our fallen selves are impatient and often stray. The Jesus Prayer does not assume that if we just say it more then Jesus will listen, quite the opposite. If we say it more our hearts may listen to God. The Jesus Prayer is about opening to the reality of Jesus, who promised as our Lord He would be with us until the end of days.

Actually, I think our regular prayer life falls victim to Jesus' criticism much more. How often can we pray thinking that if we just say the right thing, or just be passionate enough, or even just stay awake that Jesus will hear and answer. The worry here is for a prayer life that is seen to be mechanistic - where we apply the right inputs (amount, frequency, etc.) and Jesus will have to respond. The Jesus Prayer is about opening to the God who is with us, it is about the reality of our fall and how wicked we remain. In actuality, it is saying that because of our inability to pray rightly, I will open to you as a person, and trust in your providence, your love, and your grace.

 11/20/2006 7:49:00 PM
User is offlineRobin
20 posts


Re: Repetitive Prayer
 (N/A) Modified By Robin  on 11/20/2006 12:49:43 PM)
 kcstrobel wrote
In the disciplines section, someone left this comment: How do you reconcile repetitive prayer in light of Jesus saying we should not be "like pagans, who think they will be heard for their many words..."

I was raised Evangelical/Protestant and taught that any prayer that wasn't made up on the spot was "vain repetition" and should be avoided like the plague. Twenty years later, God gave me an adopted brother who is Roman Catholic and who loves Jesus with the same passion I do. My brother has introduced me to prayers written by other believers, some of whom went to Heaven a long time ago. I have found that when I'm under fire, in the heat of spiritual warfare, some prewritten prayer can be more than handy, it can be a Godsend. I have a laminated copy of St. Patrick's Breastplate in my car and a laminated copy of John Eldredge's Prayer for Life on my nightstand. That prayer is a composite of many scriptures on the Resurrection Life of Christ asking God to "restore this frail branch with full union with the trunk." That prayer in on my nightstand because if I'm stuck in bed having a flareup of chronic pain, that's the prayer I need to pray. Those are the scriptures I need to be reminded of.

I talk to Jesus in my own words all day long. But in case of emergency, break glass!

 kcstrobel wroteHow often can we pray thinking that if we just say the right thing, or just be passionate enough, or even just stay awake that Jesus will hear and answer. The worry here is for a prayer life that is seen to be mechanistic - where we apply the right inputs (amount, frequency, etc.) and Jesus will have to respond.

This is what I call the God-as-ATM dynamic and I have seen this dynamic play out in all manner of flakey extremes. God has been so patient with me and has brought me to a place of balance where I pray scriptures relevant to my need (been praying Psalm 34 over my family) but I pray those scriptures in the context of an intimate relationship with Christ.

Good point on the Jesus prayer, and great topic, Kyle. I'm glad you brought it up.  -Robin

growing, learning, enjoying the ride
 11/21/2006 3:54:59 AM
User is offlineKevinK
6 posts


Re: Repetitive Prayer
 (United States)
A friend of mine helped me answer this. Speaking from his own experience, he described how he had been warned against meaningless rote prayer. To this I already related. He then said, "but nobody every warned me against meaningless spontaneous prayer." I had never thought about this in this way before. It was somewhat of an epiphany when I realized that sponteneity in prayer can be just as vain as formed prayers. I have found that often my mind is too distracted when I start pontificating in prayer, even spontaneously. When I dwell on one word or phrase over and over again, meaning is increased as I settle deeper into the reality of the words (this generally takes awhile, depending on how distracted I am.) Some phrases I have found meaningful: "Abba Father, I belong to you." From Brennan Manning Jesus Prayer or some derivative: "Jesus, have mercy on me (a sinner), etc." Taking parts of the Lord's Prayer. eg. simply repeating, "Father" or "thy kingdom come", or "thy will be done". I have found that when I hurry over the whole prayer I get lost. Take one phrase at a time and chew on it. Why rush? No need to finish the prayer. The feeling that you should finish may give you insight into what you really believe about prayer.
 1/4/2007 8:40:15 PM
User is offlineAlison
5 posts


Re: Repetitive Prayer
 (United States)
I can totally relate to what both Robin and KevinK are saying. It's so easy to get caught up in thinking that originality = sincerity that I often find myself thinking as I pray, "Oops, I said something similar to that already; I need to think of a different way to phrase that." Hello!?!? Like God cares! (And like he doesn't see that I'm paying more attention to how I'm phrasing things than to the fact that I'm talking to him.) It's so frustrating to think that I'm 30 years old and have never heard anyone really teach on prayer at church. They teach us that we should pray, but not about the different kinds of prayers (like the Jesus prayer) or about the prayers of others who have gone before us (like the ones Robin mentioned).  Having been raised Protestant, my gut reaction to prewritten prayers is the same as Robin's, and what a shame that is! I actually bought a book of prayers about two years ago that was full of prayers for different circumstances and days of the week and events, and I stopped using it because I felt guilty. I think I'll go dig it up....
 1/23/2007 6:30:40 PM
User is offlinethomas
21 posts


Re: Repetitive Prayer
 (United States)
Alison, your insight and reflection is helpful. I agree you don't hear many sermons on prayer these days, but you especially don't hear sermons about how to pray, dynamics in prayer, etc. Remarkably I was reading through "The Way of the Pilgrim" this week ,which is the book that the Jesus Prayer is taken from in many ways. It is a story about a Russian peasant who travels around to find an answer for what it means to pray without ceasing. Finally, a monk tells him about the Jesus Prayer. But, I was so struck by something the monk says to the peasant. He says the same thing about the state of the church during their time (several hundred years ago) in Russia. He says that they also don't hear a lot of sermons on how to pray, dynamics in prayer, etc. When I saw your post I thought how amazing it is that the same problem that monk saw hundreds of years ago in Russia is true today in the evangelical American church. I am so encouraged to read others reflections like yours because it makes me think there is hope for change in the church. As we learn knew forms of prayer and honestly discuss different dynamics in prayer even on this website we are beginning to speak into the silence that has plagued the church on these issues.
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